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Attendance Figures: Oh Dear

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#41
offline carjam

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£8, that's £1 more than Stonebrigde Rd. As you say its not over the top compared to other higher leagues. And we all know the entertainment can and often is just as good. Even the standards of play compares with lower divisions on the F.L. However clubs have a habit of sticking a £1 on every new season. The rises have hardly been in line with inflation. Higher prices certainly have contributed to lower attendances. I have no figures but I would expect program sales to have dropped in comparison.<p>Carjam

#42
offline canfan

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I think your right about the programme sales, I for one do not always purchase a programe now unlike last season it was evey game!
Carjam what are your thoughts regarding the new thread what is costs??

#43
offline Simon BTFC

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I think that £8 is a lot, during the week I went to watch Bristol Rovers v Yeovil in the LDV vans trophy. Rovers had cut the admission to £5, I bought a programme for £1 and a pasty and a cup of tea (the Pasty I had is up their with the purfleet burger as top notch footie food btw) for £2. Total cost £8. Billericay have definately benefitted from keeping the admittance at £7 for three seasons, but I would like to see ticket prices cut for some games in an attempt to get more people through the gate. I'm not sure on the rules, but are clubs allowed to cut prices for league/county cup matches?

#44
offline canfan

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If my memory serves me right prices for home fa cup matches at Canvey were increased to £10 last year, yes we all moaned especially when I attended the daganham and Canvey cup game at the begining of this season and paid a fiver.I could go on and gripe about having to pay for my son who is under 5 years old. I mustn't complain to much though every penny I paid last season was well and truly worth it.

#45
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<img src="graemlins/22ignore.gif" border="0" alt="[22ignore]" />
Nice to see so many of you (all in fact)not including Braintree Town (The real BTFC) in your list for teams with a long term future in the Ryman League or better. Everybody seems to go on about the history of the clubs, what they HAVE done, the crowds they USED to pull in, the results they USED to achieve. Romford are a spent force, as are Enfield who will be the club relegated from the Ryman Premier this season.Mark this date and remember it come the end of the season. We are a growing club, with an ambitious Chairman and board, a ground that is growing with us, and a playing surface equal to anything in this league. Ignore us at your peril!!!!! images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0 images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0

#46
offline carjam

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Has the second half at Gravesend had no effect on you whatsoever.

#47
offline Cressing Toad

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Yeah it sure had an effect on us, we're learning, in fact all our losses have been by three clear goals. I put that down to lack of experience, in other words when we get unhinged we fall apart. Even Fleet fans will agree we shouldn't have let the score get exaggerated. Recovery skills are required and going on our return of form after previous such reversals we'll do ok. As long as we're top five and ahead of Billericay & Chesham and my bet stays sweet. images/icons/grin.gif" border="0 <p>A long with Iron maiden (is that you maggie?, I was amused at the old boys club only speak of other clubs that have been on the isthmian circuit for some time as worthy of consideration for promotion or retaining premier status. When i saw Braintree ommitted, my second instinct was to laugh and think its all true, we'll be up up and away while you're still contemplating a trip to Croydon. Not this year, but soon.<p>The other point i'd like to make, is the garbage about Romford being a fine old club. Get real! Its nothing of the sort. The fine old club with 1000+ gates became defunct before Billericay had left playing Junior status football. The club now utilising the old name are grubby old Collier Row, whose ground (former) isn't even in Romford. They have never played in the Southern league ever.

#48
offline carjam

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I cant argue with your bet. The way its going you will probably win. As far as Romford go they and you are probably aware of this. They and Collier Row merged. That was that for Collier after one season using both names. That dosent mean much. The main thing on their side was that when Romford packed it in they never went bust. They sold that big old ground of theirs with a promise of a new one. It went wrong over council problems. The club still holds much of the money. Once the ground situation is sorted they can attract the support again and move up. 10 years from now the 3 biggest clubs in Essex will be Southend, Chelmsford and Romford. Wait and see.
Braintree have done very well to get so far. Enjoy your football at this level. Do you really want crowd segregation, very long away trips, increased prices and years of struggling in higher leagues.
Car Jam

#49
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<img src="graemlins/icon21.gif" border="0" alt="[icon21]" /> <img src="graemlins/icon21.gif" border="0" alt="[icon21]" />
If Romford have got so much money 'stashed away ' for a rainy day its a shame they dont invest a bit of it in a new kettle so that you can get a decent cup of tea without blowing the floodlights!! As I said they are a spent force, unlike BTFC(The real Braintree Town Football Club)who are going places!!! <img src="graemlins/20deadflies.gif" border="0" alt="[20deadflies]" /> <img src="graemlins/20deadflies.gif" border="0" alt="[20deadflies]" />

#50
offline SteveP

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I like Braintree, they play good football, but I would not try and categorise you as I don't really know enough about you to make an assesment, so there you have it, I am not being arrogant, I am just being ingnorant, which is not as bad images/icons/smile.gif" border="0

#51
offline carjam

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Err, re that Braintree fan. (Steve Chesham, I know them well) Correct you are a friendly club with friendly fans. I spent the second half at Stonebridge Rd talking to a couple of them behind the Gravesend goal. Really nice people and really gracious in defeat. <p>But
Braintree will never be a long-term force in non-league soccer until<p>· They get a bigger ground
· Southend, Canvey, Billericay, Romford, West Ham, Chelmsford and all the other local sides with more potential no longer exist.
· There is a population explosion in Braintree
· The Earth stops spinning<p>
Sorry but enjoy your good times whilst they last.<p>Carjam

#52
offline Cressing Toad

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Braintree district council with a population of 130,000 (with 42000 in the town and adjoining districts)is considerably more populous than Rushden and Irthlinborough combined and larger than Billericays 30000. Does the ground have to hold more than 3000? I wonder if Carjam has plucked his notions from out an orifice where the sun don't shine.
To see populations click the BDC link at:
[URL=http://www.braintree.gov.uk/memdb.htm]<p>[ 05 November 2001: This message was edited by: Iron knob ]</p>

#53
offline ChrisA2002

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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr> ALDERSHOT you are not of this league and I expect all your fans wonder just why you are still here <hr></blockquote><p>Yes, how right your are carjam. <img src="graemlins/cry.gif" border="0" alt="cry" /> <p>But I wonder how long we can sustain this support if we stay in this division much longer, some of the support may eventually fade away if we stagnate here much longer.<p>On the plus side most teams in this division seem to be seeing an overall increase in gate. Good thing for NL football as a whole. <p>I'm not sure many of the teams have potential for the league in this division - maybe Sutton & Gravesend ?<p>The rest could all probably survive in the conference, purely on the increase away support that you'd get from the better supported teams that are there like Yeovil etc.

#54
offline Simon BTFC

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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr>Braintree district council with a population of 130,000 (with 42000 in the town and adjoining districts)is considerably more populous than Rushden and Irthlinborough combined and larger than Billericays 30000 <hr></blockquote><p>You're a little way off with your numbers, Iron Knob, Billericay's population is about 38,000. The challenge for Billericay is to attract fans from the other towns in the district, Billericay is part of Basildon district, total population 170,000 plus, number of Ryman/DM league clubs 1! <p>Am getting a bit pedantic here, the simple truth is that IMO none of the Essex clubs at our level are capable of playing at a much higher level than we now do. I fully expect Canvey to reach the conference in the next couple of years, but I also expect that they will struggle to stay there for more than a couple of seasons. Similarly I cannot see the likes of Braintree and Billericay ever becoming much more than Yo-yo clubs like, for example, Sutton.

#55
offline canfan

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<img src="graemlins/zornig.gif" border="0" alt="[zornig]" />
And what makes you think Canvey will not stay up for more then a couple of seasons IF promoted this season??? <img src="graemlins/images/icons/confused.gif" border="0" alt="confused" />

#56
offline Cressing Toad

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Simon BTFC<p>yeah fair post, certainly not pedantic, The point I was making is to question the relevence of the size of town, whether it be 25000 like Rushden or 80000 like Worthing Sussex,in modern day soccer, If you have a multi-millionaire Chairman who wants to take your club under his wing (re: Rushden & D) that Is of considerably more consequence. The same applies to the crowd limitation on the ground you operate from. If you average 500 what is wrong with a 3000 limit stadium? As was discussed earlier on another thread, what appears more important when non-league attendances are considered is how close you are situated to London. The clubs in the metropolis definitely pull less than those out in the shire counties. In that respect Braintree being 45 miles from London is better placed than most. By the way Carjam Southend is 35 miles from Braintree and are of no consequence to us whatsoever, which makes me feel you've never been to this part of Essex The closest premier status clubs to us are Bishops Stortford and Heybridge Swifts (both 15 miles). Colchester or Ipswich at home are considered to affect our gate the most.

#57
offline Simon BTFC

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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr> And what makes you think Canvey will not stay up for more then a couple of seasons IF promoted this season??? <hr></blockquote><p>I didn't say you wouldn't stay up for more than a couple of seasons, I said you would struggle to do so. <p>The original point was that none of the clubs (save Aldershot) in our division have big attendances - and, despite your cup success last season Canvey do not appear to be attracting new support in large numbers. My view is that Jeff King will only be able to take your club so far, and unless the interest in the club grows significantly I can't see you sustain that level of success.

#58
offline carjam

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Chris. You can&#8217;t blame Aldershot for being a little timid in their approach to moving up through the league. The last thing they would want is to end up bankrupt again. Kingstonian are in deep trouble and Dover Athletic are in either deeper trouble. Anyhow if they won ALL their games it would boring ultimately for you also. They are doing very well, but are up against 3 or 4 really good sides this season. Loosing to Gravesend, Sutton, Grays and Chesham is no surprise (they are all good sides). Expect to loose more. You will still be challenging. If not Gravesend I hope you win it. The support will stay as long as you are involved. And you are.<p>Iron Knob. Looks like you&#8217;ve been caught fiddling the figures. This isn&#8217;t the FA Cup you know. Oh and don&#8217;t expect to win that Dunmow Flitch either. Thanks Simon for sorting that one out. Correct about Southend though. Their gates I shouldn&#8217;t imagine affect anybody to any degree. Perhaps Southend Manor. So come on Iron Knob, accept the facts. Try that thread &#8216; Do You Concede Yet&#8217;. Pop back there and put your team at the end of it.<p>Canfan. I can&#8217;t put it better than Simon. Hold on tightly to Jeff King. When he goes so do you. Can&#8217;t see him going though. If he was going to loose interest he would have done so when you were relegated, to my surprise, from Div 1 a few seasons back. Canvey MUST find more support though. Things will become more expensive every time you fail.<p>Car Jam

#59
offline Guest__*

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Well said, Carjam.<p>My suspicion is that clubs which survive long-term in the conference all have an average attendance of at least 1,000 (and even that is no guarantee of survival). In order to survive in the Conference for more than a couple of years you need that sort of potential. My guess is that only a handful of Ryman Clubs can achieve that.<p>As for the Shots, I believe that our 'natural level' is the Conference. That doesn't mean that we deserve to be in the Conference (you only deserve to be in the Conference if you get there on merit) - just that if we did eventually get to the football league - success would mean staying there.

#60
offline carjam

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Agreed, that gives the 'Fleet' a chance then. They certainly had that before during our Conference years and a bit to spare if my memory of those days serves me well. There are some very long trips in the Conference though so how much away support may well be of no great consequence. Away support in the Ryman seems to be limited to a handful of clubs.
Aldershots crowd size is way above that though. In fact the support there has been amazing. Scarboro and Chester's gates have fallen to very low levels. Not sure about Barnet and Hereford's and Doncaster have like you been an exception. There is a big difference though. Those clubs just went down. They did not have to play in the Ryman third division. It's becoming clear though that there are some good sides at this level. It doesn&#8217;t matter how big your club is moving on from here is never going to be easy.




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