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    HelenC

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Why did Canvey not get promoted....

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12 replies to this topic

#1
offline Matt (GNFC)

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Trying to take an objective look over the days and messages since Gravesend won the title, i would emphasise that second place even with 95 pts has been an underachievement for Canvey this year. Canveys primary objective at the start of the year would have been to win the league, not to get to the fourth round of the FA Cup. Jeff King was right in what he said prior to the Gravesend game.Canvey are the better side and should've won the league. They had the best striker in the league in Lee Boylan and although everybody slags him off they had the best or very near the best midfielders in Mark Stimson and Chris Duffy plus excellent defenders in Steve Ward and Peter Smith. All over the pitch Canvey had class acts in team.
Gravesend and Northfleet dont have any superstars and in the close season didnt spend any money on new players. Instead their manager Andy Ford finds players who can add something to the team, be it pace, height , youth. The approach taken by Jeff King has been different and has tried to be proven league players rather than dip into the lower leagues as Andy Ford has done. For Jeff King to say that they lost the title as players werent loyal is a crime to every player who has worn the Canvey shirt this season and given everything to the cause..Canvey simply lost the title because they didnt have a manager who could motivate his players or was tactically good enough when it mattered. As Andy Ford said, it was David beating Goliath. Canvey will be a good team next year but i wonder whether they will be there or thereabouts. I hope so as they actually have an honest set of fans but with the dictator in charge feel that they could be let down badly yet again and even run into financial difficulty which no football fans want to see .

#2
offline thor

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It is hard to write on these boards without appearing to be disrespectful to others, but I will have a go.
I believe Jeff's ambition for CIFC is that they will one day play in the Nationwide league. Now you can call him what you want, but everyone of you out there would want their manager to have the same ambition. It is with this in mind that, I believe, he has built the type of squad that he has. A mixture of highly talented old pros and young players with a future ahead of them.
It is also because of this ambition that plans have been drawn up for a new, Nationwide league standard, ground.
Lets be honest, the chances of teams like ours reaching the league are more possible than say 20 years ago.
As to whether CIFC attain Jeffs ambition remains to be seen. But it is totally out of order for people to fault him for trying.
On paper I believe CIFC have the best squad in the division. More or less the same squad that beat, Port Vale & Wigan on their own grounds, Northamton in front of live t.v. cameras, and gave Burnley who were top of the 1st division a bit of a scare. More or less the same squad that beat Telford, Stevenage, Chester twice and Forest Green to lift last years F.A. Trophy.
The team that has been built not only does well it also plays extremely entertaining football. 108 goals in the league alone this season, a goal difference of 68 ( 16 teams in this division didn't get that in points). Many clubs in the division can thank this team for their biggest league home gates of the season.
At the end of the season CIFC were 22 points clear of the 3rd placed team. For most of the teams in this division the season ended on the day Croydon were relegated.
At the end of the day ( and this is where I will appear disrespectful,but do not mean to be) CIFC did not go up because they lost at Hitchin, lost to Grays and drew with Sutton. All teams that on paper CIFC should have beaten.
Personally I put it down to the players nerves not holding, whatever , I definitely do not lay the blame a Jeffs door.
10 years ago this club was close to folding, Jeff was approached and took over the running and since then it has been a marvellous ride.
You slag him off but every one of you would welcome him with open arms at your clubs. You call him a dictator well he is worth a 1000 of every suited old man on the commitees of your clubs.
Canvey will move on. Maybe not next year, or, the year after but it will move on. How many of you out there can speak with the same confidence of your own team.

#3
offline Matt (GNFC)

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Thor, yes Jeff King has done a fantastic job for Canvey and with the attendances that Canvey get you cant fault the man for investing in the club. Yet this is where the problem lies..Canvey were challenging for the title yet the attendances were nothing short of rubbish for a team at the top of the Ryman. If Jeff isnt tactically good enough how can anyone replace him as he's the man who is putting the money in the club and the board wont replace him because of that fact. U take him out of the equation as manager and he will not invest in the club to such a degree, simple as that. Hence, u are in a situation of dictatorship surely where without Jeff the club goes bankrupt. Its a situation which doesnt exist as far as i can see at other clubs..Canvey have to realise they are in a very difficult situation as they cannot get a more tactically astute man in if things start to go wrong. U plan big for Nationwide football yet so did Sittingbourne, Kingstonian etc etc.

#4
offline CANV EFM

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glenn penneyfather is the coach.. jeff knows enough about footy to know he dosen't know as much as glenn and a lot of the players at this level.. he does however excel at man management and having spoken to the bloke on a few occasions has shoulders broad enough for this set back.. he loves managing cifc and is determined to try his best to succeed at this level and hopefully a couple higher.. maybe if a few of his detractors had actually spoken to him in the bars after games they may have a different view.. totally agree with thor glenn and jeff did a fantastic job the players slipped up at the death

#5
offline Guest__*

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now i've not come on this thread for a row
but was it really david beating goliath as gravesend have an exellent fan base and with a tad of money and good advertising in local papers etc etc we really have a good chance of going places
now im not saying we are going to gointo div3 and so on but if we avoid relegation and carry on getting big gates 1400+ like in recent weeks then who knows in 5 years maybe its a possibility if the factors go our way
kent thameside is already undergoing a massive redevelopment and the town will swell with the new rail station(channel tunnel) being built and so on. so whos to say we can't have a worthy team in 5 years(if we make through th next 2)
its worth bearing in mind but with the fan base and the potential for a bit of money anything is possible!!!

#6
offline Essy

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I'm going to put my neck on the line and say that this season Canvey had the best team and squad in the Ryman League, not the Fleet. I'm willing to admit that.<p>HOWEVER the best club in the league was Gravesend and Northfleet. The management team were incredibly professional in their approach and the organization of all the officials was superb. For the first time in years we've got a chairman who is genuinely interested in the club and will go to great lengths to see us achieving success, who is fully backed by his board, who together all back the management team of Andy, Phil and Ron and give them full support, who run a squad of players with no big names or big heads, who are totally equal with eachother, and who all totally support one another.<p>That is how we won the league. In my view Canvey have the players and the finances to win the league and do well in the Conference but do not have the infrastructure or the team spirit to keep themselves going.

#7
offline Guest__*

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Nice to find a bit of sensible debate on this subject, now on paper Canvey probably do have the best squad though they certainly don't appear to have the same team spirit as Gravesend nor a manager who is able to get the best out of his players like Andy Ford clearly is. Canvey are in a rather awkward position in that the manager is also the person bankrolling the club and if he can't deliver the goods what do they do, sack him? If so surely he's likely to take his ball and go home? There have been various rumours about certain Canvey players not wanting promotion due to the increased traveling etc and that some are only at the club for the money, how true that is I don't know but there is always that risk when signing the more experienced players rather than up and coming youngsters who are hungry for sucess. Maybe JK is right in saying his players lacked loyalty Gravesend players certainly don't and the club is profesionally run from top to bottom, there are no superstars just a great team spirit. In any other season Canvey would have gone up with their points tally in fact its a shame both teams couldn't have gone up but thats another issue, perhaps they'll do it next season but I wouldn't bet on it, many teams will love putting one over the superstars, though perhaps I'll be proved wrong. Its hard to see them having any long term success though, their attendances must be a source of great embarrasment to them and without JK's money they'll have nothing, Gravesend on the other hand have a great fan base and whilst next season they'll probably settle for 4th from bottom with Andy Ford at the helm and an abitious board and chairman behind him the long term prospects look good, as for Canvey I wonder where they'll be in a few years time, somebody mentioned Kingstonian in an earlier posting, back to back Trophy winners just a few years back but look at them now.

#8
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Well my concern is that the team is going to break up. We may have the money but you cant just build a team overnight.
Canvey have been lucky in the last few years to have players like Tilson, Stimson and Bodley who have played at a higher level and were able to inspire lesser talented team mates.
I would doubt that any of those players I mentioned will be back next season. They will be very hard to replace.
My fear is that we have missed our best chance of making the conference everything was geared to going up this season. Unfortuntely Gravesend had to go and spoil it by more than matching us.<p>If Canvey had made the Conference Ive no doubt we would have more than held our own and maybe in a few years we might have been in a position to fight for the title but now we are back to square one, still battling to fight to get out of this League. It will not be easy next season either the likes of Aldershot, Purfleet and Grays will be up there.

#9
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it`s unfortunate what has happened at canvey over the last 2 month`s regarding players but i believe up to the bunley game we were unbeatable then we lost, then 72 hrs later lost to g&n after that our invinsability went and we struggled there after.as for the conference i think g&n will do well,look at farnbourgh i don`t think they were that good last year but have done very well.as for jeff he`s damned if he does and damned if he dont,we had a good run in the cup which has set us up for 3 or 4 years,but it may have cost us the league.do you take the money or take the title.with whats happened with itv digital clubs need money more than ever,and the clubs with money can now have the pick of the good players(not that that bring`s success)as i see it clubs with good player policy`s or money will win in the near future,as for the club`s that have neither im afraid i can only see tear`s.i think g&n have a bit of both and will do us ryman boy`s proud hopefully we will see them next year(as we go up and they go down ha ha ha)best of luck and COME ON THE NEW SEASON.

#10
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well thats quite fair! I do think we fell at a few hurdles, but hopefully we can learn from that. It could makes us a stronger team. But GNFC and us were both far to superior for the Ryman prem and the points show that. So in fairness the league structure let us down. So the next season should be rather interesting. COME ON YOU YELLOWS!!!!!

#11
offline Rob_the_Saint

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Sorry to intrude on your private moments of grief (ha!) but I'll just leave this one message and go.<p>In my opinion your squad was not nearly as good as in 2000-01; you had a bad start, recovered in the middle but fell away again at the end. What I think we're seeing is the end of an era, where players are reaching the end of their senior careers and the young players are just not quite ready yet. You may well have a difficult season next time around as you attempt to rebuild your squad so just be patient. I don't think you'll go down, but you may have to settle for mid-table mediocrity for one season at least. There, that didn't hurt too much, did it?

#12
offline CANV EFM

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carbon copy of last season really start bad.. finish bad and have a wobble around mid season...
i think the squad was better boylan and cobby added up front plus a record haul of points and goals, it wasnt enough but it was the best we have ever got ...
start of next season and this summers moves will be interesting

#13
offline Merv

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Fair comment from Rob the Saint. The only certain thing about football is that nothing is certain. He might be right but he could end up with egg on his face. Nice thing is, we can argue about it (without crude and stupid comments) and discuss it and then, next May the ones who were right can rub salt into the wounds of the ones who were wrong.<p>IMHO next season will be Canvey's season. They will sort out the inconsistency that has dogged them this year. But who will take over our runners-up spot?




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