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I feel sorry for Mackay, he has been hung out to dry and as he said in his interview he clearly isn't racist, homophobic, sexist or anti-semitic:

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2732188/Malky-Mackay-called-Cardiff-City-Malaysian-owner-Vincent-Tan-chink.html

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Rother - I've never been more serious in my life, Mackay is a thoroughly decent chap and the whole thing is a sinister vendetta by Vincent Tan, afterall, who spends £750,000 on an investigation just to get back at someone and try to ruin them, they say cross a Chinaman at your peril don't they!

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they say cross a Chinaman at your peril don't they!

Can't say I've ever heard that but saying it could be construed as stereotyping at best really.

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Every person in a democratic country in my opinion is entitled to say whatever they want in private,whether it be to a friend on a bus or in a pub,or by text or by an e mail,I hate this countries obsession with stitching people up,grassing & making money out of stitching someone up.

Although everyone does have a right to hold any opinion,some opinions are obviously not nice but if it's private it should remain that way.

Why didn't the people in the texts or e mails object to what he was saying etc.

The facts are that He and Vincent Tan did not get on one bit and this Tan bloke is systematic of everything that's wrong in the game in this country,he probably isn't going to be nice and the word "chink" while not nice,is not the worst insult,I have a Chinese mate whose nickname is chink from childhood and he uses it himself,it doesn't seem to bother him or any of the Chinese people he is related to,his mum even calls it to him ,still you wouldn't call someone it in public if you was a high profile person.

The homophobic bit,wasn't nice really but it's only 15 or so years since it was legalised here and sometimes I think people do think that every single person in the UK has accepted it now when for most of the people in the uks lives it was viewed as something wrong ,you are not going to change everyone's views in 15 years or less

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I actually made the League Managers Association (LMA) spot on with their original statement that it was just 'banter', we've all done it haven't we and as Eastside Urchin rightly said, every person in a democratic Country is entitled to say whatever they want in private.

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I actually made the League Managers Association (LMA) spot on with their original statement that it was just 'banter', we've all done it haven't we and as Eastside Urchin rightly said, every person in a democratic Country is entitled to say whatever they want in private.

Well I believe the law takes a dim view of planning crime or terrorism in private but being a bigot is just generally interesting to the rest of us, kind of lets us know who we should trust.

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Yes but Mackay isn't a bigot though is he, that's my point

Well it's a fairly weak one given the evidence. 

 

Next point?

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Loosely - I don't think calling a Chinaman 'a Chink' is being a bigot do you

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Loosely - I don't think calling a Chinaman 'a Chink' is being a bigot do you

Well let's see shall we Rhodesly, did he just call his owner Vincent Tan a "chink", which btw most people believe is racist but you don't apparently.

 

Here are his texts:

 

'Fkn chinkys. Fk it. There's enough dogs in Cardiff for us all to go around.'

On the arrival of South Korean international Kim Bo-Kyung

'Go on, fat Phil. Nothing like a Jew that sees money slipping through his fingers'

On football agent Phil Smith

'He's a snake, a gay snake. Not to be trusted'

On an official of another club

'Not many white faces amongst that lot but worth considering.'

On a list of potential signings

'I hope she's looking after your needs. I bet you'd love a bounce on her falsies.'

On a player's female agent

A picture entitled Black Monopoly (where every square was a "Go to Jail" square)

 

Looks fairly conclusively like a racist, bigot and homophobe to me Rhodesly.

 

So folks if Rhodesly thinks that is ok then that must make him a bigot, racist and homophobe also.

 

Edited by Loose

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did he just call his owner Vincent Tan a "chink", which btw most people believe is racist but you don't apparently

Well neither does Eastside Urchin who has a Chinese mate nicknamed 'Chink' from childhood and who actually uses it himself. C'mon, we've all texted the things Mackay texted in private, as Eastside Urchin rightly said every person in a democratic Country is entitled to say whatever they want in private.

 

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Well neither does Eastside Urchin who has a Chinese mate nicknamed 'Chink' from childhood and who actually uses it himself. C'mon, we've all texted the things Mackay texted in private, as Eastside Urchin rightly said every person in a democratic Country is entitled to say whatever they want in private.

 

Oh, you want another game.

 

It's pretty much irrelevant what Urchin has to say about a chinese friend who may or may not like being called that name. It's also completely irrelevant that Mackay thought he was saying these things in private, Why? Because he was using the company phone wasn't he? Company phones aren't private, the content and use of them remains the property of the company.

 

And you working for the M.o.D thinking that anything we say or text over the mobile network is private is a laugh. Everyone but you it seems knows that nothing on a phone network that is said, texted or sent by MMS is private thanks to you and your buddies the US NSA.

 

In any case, as I said, it's always nice to know what people are really like when they think they are talking in private since it is always more revealing and a sign of what they really think when they don't say it publicly. It's good to know that racism and homophobia is being taken seriously by the Footballing Authorities, after all, it is the 21st Century Rhodesly.

Edited by Loose

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My last employer was a very PC organization and some years ago everyone had to waste (sorry, spend) a whole day on diversity training. At the time we had a young Australian called skippy working for us, and we was told in no uncertain terms that we was never to address him by that name again as it was racist, even though his English mother called him it. We also had quite a few black guys working there who often would call each other n***** boy, but had one of us whiteys used that term we would have been fired. As far as I'm concerned people can call me a Brit, limey, white honkey or whatever they want and I wont be offended, and IMO all this PC nonsense has just gone too far.   

Edited by missunderstood

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My last employer was a very PC organization and some years ago everyone had to waste (sorry, spend) a whole day on diversity training. At the time we had a young Australian called flipper working for us, and we was told in no uncertain terms that we was never to address him by that name again as it was racist, even though his English mother called him it. We also had quite a few black guys working there who often would call each other n***** boy, but had one of us whiteys used that term we would have been fired. As far as I'm concerned people can call me a Brit, limey, white honkey or whatever they want and I wont be offended, and IMO all this PC nonsense has just gone too far.   

So you seem to be saying, and Smudge too since he liked your post that this is ok:-

 

 

'Fkn chinkys. Fk it. There's enough dogs in Cardiff for us all to go around.'

On the arrival of South Korean international Kim Bo-Kyung

'Go on, fat Phil. Nothing like a Jew that sees money slipping through his fingers'

On football agent Phil Smith

'He's a snake, a gay snake. Not to be trusted'

On an official of another club

'Not many white faces amongst that lot but worth considering.'

On a list of potential signings

'I hope she's looking after your needs. I bet you'd love a bounce on her falsies.'

On a player's female agent

A picture entitled Black Monopoly (where every square was a "Go to Jail" square)

 

 

Fair enough, it's always good to know where we stand.

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In this case Malky has been a bit stupid. Using a company phone takes away the privacy element, same as using company e-mails.

 

What you say in private to your friends, as long as you are not planning to incite violence should remain private.

 

I do get annoyed however when people are so desperate to be offended that they will deliberately take things out of context.

 

I also get annoyed when I have to think about everything I say before saying it in case it's misconstrued, I then end up having to explain what I actually mean. 

In those cases, I would go so far as to say that freedom is speech is being affected.

 

I would just add at this point that I'm not saying that racism or sexism or any other ism is justified BTW.

Edited by cup of tea

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In this case Malky has been a bit stupid. Using a company phone takes away the privacy element, same as using company e-mails.

 

What you say in private to your friends, as long as you are not planning to incite violence should remain private.

 

I do get annoyed however when people are so desperate to be offended that they will deliberately take things out of context.

 

I also get annoyed when I have to think about everything I say before saying it in case it's misconstrued, I then end up having to explain what I actually mean. 

In those cases, I would go so far as to say that freedom is speech is being affected.

I think all this "in privacy stuff" is fine but really, you're not much of a man if you wouldn't be prepared to say it in public, say at a football game or in the bar after a game in front of your players. 

 

Let's see. Any of you got any black or asian players at your club? How about you each record on video yourself saying "Have we got enough white faces on the team" in front of the whole squad? 

 

Yeah, football has meant to have changed, we certainly know that the FA don't appreciate managers and players making these comments in public or private so let's find out how much your club likes your personal views.

 

Come on lads, enough of the couching this stone age racism as banter and private, stand up and admit you're a racist or if not then it's time to say there's no place in football in the UK for these people.

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I also get annoyed when I have to think about everything I say before saying it in case it's misconstrued

Yes, i know the feeling, like I say you have to feel sorry for Malky as he has been hung out to dry, lets hope Cardiff don't return to the Premiership any time soon so the vindictive Vincent Tan gets his come uppance financially where it will hurt him most.

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You are, of course correct. There's no place for racism in football, or anywhere else for that matter.

 

Is being openly racist going to help the general situation or is it like prodding a snake? You could argue that it's good to get these opinions out in the open so we can have an honest debate about it but I think it might cause even more resentment and be counter-productive. Some people will never change, they can't as it's been part of their upbringing. If they admit they are racist does that really help the situation. I hope with each passing generation things become better and attitudes change.

 

Could you have imagined a black president of the USA 50 years ago or a woman football commentator in the BBC 30 years ago. We are moving forward.

 

My issue was that you shouldn't have to be careful about what you say in case it was taken out of context. If you are openly being racist then that's different.

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You are, of course correct. There's no place for racism in football, or anywhere else for that matter.

 

Is being openly racist going to help the general situation or is it like prodding a snake? You could argue that it's good to get these opinions out in the open so we can have an honest debate about it but I think it might cause even more resentment and be counter-productive. Some people will never change, they can't as it's been part of their upbringing. If they admit they are racist does that really help the situation. I hope with each passing generation things become better and attitudes change.

 

Could you have imagined a black president of the USA 50 years ago or a woman football commentator in the BBC 30 years ago. We are moving forward.

 

My issue was that you shouldn't have to be careful about what you say in case it was taken out of context. If you are openly being racist then that's different.

I'm glad you agree in the main, however as regards being counter productive I simply tire of people attempting to hide their racism behind the old PC argument, you can't be a little pregnant can you? Therefore you can't be a little racist, you either are, or you aren't and as you agree there's no place for it in football anymore, the racism and homophobia I think it's best we know where we stand, as soon as people start to prevaricate I realise that it comes down to cowardice and dishonesty. A lot of footballers read these pages, in a lot of cases they simply couldn't care less about anything but the football, but a lot of our young footballers aren't all IC1 straight males. Fortunately the people who can't change are dinosaurs.

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I'm not defending racism either privately or publically, I just think that asking people who can't/won't change their minds to be public isn't going to help anyone - dinosaurs, good description. I'd like to think that people like that will just disappear over time. I certainly don't want to give them the desire to share their views with impressionable young people.

 

With regards to political correctness, I think we might have cross lines here. I'm not talking about thinly-veiled racism / Sexism / Homophobia. I'm talking about an innocent comment taken out of context. None of the examples that Malky Mackay that you put on here earlier could possibly be misinterpreted - it's obvious what his opinions are.

 

I'm not racist - I don't feel that I should be worried about what I say in case someone takes my words out of context and accuse me of being so. That's when I think PC goes too far.

Edited by cup of tea

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I'm not defending racism either privately or publically, I just think that asking people who can't/won't change their minds to be public isn't going to help anyone - dinosaurs, good description. I'd like to think that people like that will just disappear over time. I certainly don't want to give them the desire to share their views with impressionable young people.

 

With regards to political correctness, I think we might have cross lines here. I'm not talking about thinly-veiled racism / Sexism / Homophobia. I'm talking about an innocent comment taken out of context. None of the examples that Malky Mackay that you put on here earlier could possibly be misinterpreted - it's obvious what his opinions are.

 

I'm not racist - I don't feel that I should be worried about what I say in case someone takes my words out of context and accuse me of being so. That's when I think PC goes too far.

No, nothing aimed at you, just anyone who attempts to make this a discussion - or an excuse for Mackay - of "PC gone mad". Got nothing to do with being 'PC' has it, or Banter for that matter, I think thats been seen through by the FA and football fans alike?

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