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52 replies to this topic

#21
offline TB&G

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Originally Posted By: Ribbit
The Essex teams in the ECL should be forced to move to the ESL - another ridiculous circumstance.


Why ridiculous?

As a long time fan of a club currently in the ESL I would be delighted if our constitution were to be made up to a minimum of 20 teams for obvious reasons and don't see why some teams from mid Essex southwards in the Premier/Div 1 of the ECL shouldn't be invited to transfer to our league to make that number up.

After all there is much talk around non-league football regarding clubs being allocated to the league in their most suitable geographical location relative to the level at which they presently play to keep travelling expenses down to a minimum.

However there will alway be clubs on the fringe of two different league areas who may have to consider that they may be asked to move across.

Personally, I would think that travelling to grounds new can revitalise things rather than playing the same old teams and visiting the same old grounds. Although leagues with more than one division have a benefit of an automatic visit to one or two new grounds each new season after the relegation and promotion issues have been settled.



#22
offline ronin

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Originally Posted By: YELLOW
Do you mean the Essex clubs currently in the Ridgeons League?


It`s the same league, Ridgeon sponser the Eastern Counties League.

#23
offline Ribbit

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Originally Posted By: YELLOW
Do you mean the Essex clubs currently in the Ridgeons League?

I would be assuming the likes of Harwich, Halstead, Saffron Walden, Tiptree etc.


Yep, those are the clubs I'm talking about. Quite what they're doing sodding around with the likes of Norwich United and various Cambridge sides I don't know.
They should be in the ESL with Romford and Concord. The ESL needs these teams to gain strength and make it a league worth playing in.

#24
offline ronin

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Is Harwich v Concord or Bowers a viable game at Essex Senior level? The travel costs have to come into it as well.

#25
offline Ribbit

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It's not that far. It's sensical, anyway. The last stage in regonalised leagues (before seperate town leagues - ie Southend League) should be county leagues. Personally I'd abolish the ECL and create new Suffolk and Norfolk leagues.

#26
offline sudburyroyal

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Most of the Essex teams in the Ridgeons have refused point blank to join the ESL....they, for some reason hate it with a passion....in fact Saffron Waldon dropped out of competitive football for a year, whilst waiting to get in the ridgeons....rather than play in the ESL. There has been talk of the likes of Halstead,Clacton etc being forced into the ESL....which caused near meltdown of the ECL fans forum, such was the feeling against the move !!!

#27
offline Ribbit

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Out of interest how does promotion/relegation work between the ESL and the Essex Olympian League? Or doesn't it? I'm just looking at the maps on this http://www.thepyrami...p/leaguemap.htm site and realised that there is only 41 teams amongst 3 divisions in the EOL. Surely condensing that into two divisions would be better and possibly forming some sort of alliance with the ESL.

But then I don't know what kind of relation the two leagues have, or how close the level of football is.

#28
offline Ribbit

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Originally Posted By: sudburyroyal
Most of the Essex teams in the Ridgeons have refused point blank to join the ESL....they, for some reason hate it with a passion....in fact Saffron Waldon dropped out of competitive football for a year, whilst waiting to get in the ridgeons....rather than play in the ESL. There has been talk of the likes of Halstead,Clacton etc being forced into the ESL....which caused near meltdown of the ECL fans forum, such was the feeling against the move !!!


And thus, another reason to dislike snotty north Essex W*nkers! laugh

#29
offline ronin

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Originally Posted By: Ribbit
Out of interest how does promotion/relegation work between the ESL and the Essex Olympian League? Or doesn't it? I'm just looking at the maps on this http://www.thepyrami...p/leaguemap.htm site and realised that there is only 41 teams amongst 3 divisions in the EOL. Surely condensing that into two divisions would be better and possibly forming some sort of alliance with the ESL.

But then I don't know what kind of relation the two leagues have, or how close the level of football is.


I don`t think there is any automatic promotion from the Essex Olympian, my guess is the grounds won`t be up to ESL standard.

http://www.tonykemps...elrules0607.htm

#30
offline Ribbit

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Yeah, I was just looking on the EOL site and there is a map for park pitches, so maybe that's best avoided. tongue

I think the entire structure of football is this country needs to be re-built from the top right the way down to the very lowest league.

#31
offline TB&G

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Originally Posted By: Ribbit
Yeah, I was just looking on the EOL site and there is a map for park pitches, so maybe that's best avoided. tongue

I think the entire structure of football is this country needs to be re-built from the top right the way down to the very lowest league.


I agree although I did say from mid Essex southwards in my original post.

I suspect that the main objection to ECL clubs moving over to the ESL is the size of the league and home crowd bases. This apparent problem would change though wouldn't it if they did move. It will be interesting to see what the FA Leagues Committee have in mind to address that issue when they publish their 2007/8 plans just after May 14.

In the meantime I would point out that the EOL is level 7 and the ESL level 5 so direct promotion is not an option although it may be allowed if a particular ground is up to standard which it probably wont be without major work as most if not all of the EOL teams play on park pitches.

This brings me to another contentious issue which is ground grading.

I think that it's nonsense for clubs to have to prepare their ground for up to 3,000 spectators with seating for (I believe) 200 when most if not all the season many clubs at level 5 and even 4 have less than 100 or so spectators or not many more at their home games.

All this does is cater for the very, very, very occasional times when a particular club has a good cup run. And then they might get faced with the problem of a whacking great bill from the bill for policing as one club (was it Havant & Waterlooville) had this season?

ABSOLUTE NONSENSE!

#32
offline Eastside Urchin

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part of the problems is ground grading to get into the essex senior league,it is all bollox in my opinion as with due respect to the clubs in the league,ground grading shouldn't be an issue,even to those coming up.Clubs coming up into the essex senior league should be given at least 2-3 years grace to get ground upto the relevant grading,i think they forget that the majority of these clubs are small amateur clubs,not the size of hornchurch,canvey etc etc and the costs for some of these teams to get ground grading is crippling so many don't bother.
I went to every away ground bar one the season we was in the ESL and there were never problems with safety,in fact all you need is a pitch,a bar or refreshments and places for supporters to stand,obviously adequate changing facilities for players and officials but the authorities want more and its not fair on some of the clubs.Many average 15-20 people per game.


#33
offline TB&G

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Originally Posted By: urchin_mentalist
part of the problems is ground grading to get into the essex senior league,it is all bollox in my opinion as with due respect to the clubs in the league,ground grading shouldn't be an issue,even to those coming up.Clubs coming up into the essex senior league should be given at least 2-3 years grace to get ground upto the relevant grading,i think they forget that the majority of these clubs are small amateur clubs,not the size of hornchurch,canvey etc etc and the costs for some of these teams to get ground grading is crippling so many don't bother.
I went to every away ground bar one the season we was in the ESL and there were never problems with safety,in fact all you need is a pitch,a bar or refreshments and places for supporters to stand,obviously adequate changing facilities for players and officials but the authorities want more and its not fair on some of the clubs.Many average 15-20 people per game.



Just the point that I was trying to make UM but the powers that be live in a fantasy world in regard to the basic playing and support facilities needed by most clubs below level 3 in the non-league pyramid.

#34
offline ronin

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I agree that most of the ground grading is ott but i think what the ESL/F.A. are worried about is teams coming into the league without a proper set-up and folding half-way through the season. If a club is commited enough to get the required grading it is more than likely going to stay around and try and build on what they have.



#35
offline Eastside Urchin

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in all honesty those clubs at the level below grade 5 just want a chance,at least they should be given the chance to compete in a level above without the usual beurocracy and red tape that stops them at the moment

#36
offline Ribbit

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I completely agree. There should be automatic promotion/relegations from all leagues. No-one should have to apply and as long as the ground is good enough (read: basic saftey) they'll be allowed in.

I did notice that EOL is level 7 opposed to the ESL at level 5. Is there a league at level 6 in Essex?

#37
offline YELLOW

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Problem is with alot of the clubs at Essex Olympian level is they have no facilities to pay on the gate (which is required at ESL level) and as they often share their pitch with other nearby pitches this needs to be sectioned off which costs a bit of money.

I think that's the problem White Ensign are facing regarding their ground.

#38
offline Ribbit

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It's a shame, because in an ideal world everything would run like clockwork - every club would have its own ground and there would be no messing around regarding promotions or relegations.
Unfortunately we don't live in an ideal world and the people running the game in this country don't know what they're doing. It's not that hard to restructure our leagues.

#39
offline ronin

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Originally Posted By: Ribbit
It's not that hard to restructure our leagues.


If they were to start from scratch (Conference downwards) then yes it could be done but that won`t happen. No club is going to give up a place in a division which it has taken them decades to reach without a fight but that`s what would have to happen if the restructuring you want was to happen.


#40
offline Ribbit

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Not necassarily. I just believe that for every league there needs to be two leagues below it. Promotion would be the champions plus play-off winners and relegation would be the bottom four (obviously split into the appropriate regions).




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