Worthing v Enfield Town

[lovely stuff]

Even if we scrape into the play-offs the chances of progressing are going to be low..We consistently stuggle in 3 areas..

1.Against top five opposition

2.In big matches

3.In away games featuring large crowds

Edited February 28, 2022 by lovely stuff

[Bottoms Up]

Still a long way to go, 10 games I think?

We could still finish 7th or 2nd, my gut feeling says 3rd or 4th

[Barney]

Some pretty balanced responses mixed in with the usual knee jerk comments when we lose a game... It was unfortunate that the game the previous week was postponed, as I feel that was our opportunity to put the two poor defeats against Stortford and Wingate right. Playing Worthing away, who have shown they're the best side in the league both this season, and in the previous two curtailed seasons wasn't what we needed, and I'd pretty much written this one off as a free hit, but not one that we were likely to get anything out of being realistic. Obviously disappointed to lose the game 0-3, but we absolutely now must start looking forward to the run in, rather than dwelling on this too much in my view, and I hope the management and the squad think the same.

I think Andy and the management team do deserve a lot of credit for a lot of things, digging us out of a massive hole 5 years ago by assembling a competitive squad from almost nothing, winning a trophy a couple of years ago, and then putting together one of the most exciting groups of players that I've seen represent Town in 20+ years this season. I've said before, it's frustrating that we don't retain possession well and rely heavily on our talented attacking players to make something out of nothing to beat sides, and that we seem to lack defensive shape and organisation at times. It's a lot about game management - look at Stortford when we played them, I don't think they had nearly the attacking talent available that we did, but they were a well organised, well drilled unit who nullified us, and scrapped for every 50/50 and second ball. That's what I think we're lacking, and why we come unstuck against the better sides in the league who can stop us scoring freely.

I do think we might make the playoffs unless the wheels really start to come off from here - we've proven that we can beat the lower sides in the league, and our run in, on paper looks favourable to us, although I'd much rather be playing mid table sides than teams that are fighting for their survival in the league, and there will no doubt be some banana skins along the way that we do slip up on. As others have said, it's looking more and more like 4 from 5 to make the play offs, with Worthing being worthy winners... but there's a lot of football to play. Personally, I'd say 5th is a successful season, and I'd have taken that happily in August, and whilst over two one off games, you never know what can happen, our record against the better (and better organised) sides speaks for itself.

Does this mean that I don't think the management are the right people to take us forwards? I'm torn on this, I like Andy and team - they come across well whenever I've seen them interviewed and clearly care. They've shown they can assemble an excellent, and exciting squad and in spite of the shortcomings, I really enjoy watching this team. I think it's very unfair to suggest that we lack ambition as a club and don't want promotion, I think everyone at the club would agree that we want to get into the National South, but realistically that is the upper limit of our ambitions for the time being. Look at some of the cubs at that level, and the step above - they're huge sides with professional playing staff, and if we can get promoted, I'd be more than happy with consolidation/survival at that level. On the flip side, I think that we'd stand a better chance with a more organised, well drilled, maybe less individually talented team that retained possession better. I'm also very cautious as to what I wish for, as Andy and team have delivered one of the most successful seasons in our history, and any new management team coming in might well not make us more competitive.

I think overall we have to be pragmatic about what we can achieve as a club (I know I'll be accused of lacking ambition here by some), but relatively speaking we don't have a massive budget, aren't bankrolled by a money man, so we have to grow sustainably and organically. This clearly takes time, but in my view we're doing it the right way - gradually growing attendances, putting in place an academy scheme, embedding ourselves in the local community, looking at other income streams. Yes I'd love to be flying up the pyramid with a promotion every 5 or 10 years, but I don't think that's realistic - I'm immensely proud of the club and all it stands for, and even if we're at this level for the foreseeable future, I think it's a fantastic achievement for all involved.

Edited February 28, 2022 by Barney
Typos

[lovely stuff]

3 hours ago, Barney said:

Some pretty balanced responses mixed in with the usual knee jerk comments when we lose a game... It was unfortunate that the game the previous week was postponed, as I feel that was our opportunity to put the two poor defeats against Stortford and Wingate right. Playing Worthing away, who have shown they're the best side in the league both this season, and in the previous two curtailed seasons wasn't what we needed, and I'd pretty much written this one off as a free hit, but not one that we were likely to get anything out of being realistic. Obviously disappointed to lose the game 0-3, but we absolutely now must start looking forward to the run in, rather than dwelling on this too much in my view, and I hope the management and the squad think the same.

I think Andy and the management team do deserve a lot of credit for a lot of things, digging us out of a massive hole 5 years ago by assembling a competitive squad from almost nothing, winning a trophy a couple of years ago, and then putting together one of the most exciting groups of players that I've seen represent Town in 20+ years this season. I've said before, it's frustrating that we don't retain possession well and rely heavily on our talented attacking players to make something out of nothing to beat sides, and that we seem to lack defensive shape and organisation at times. It's a lot about game management - look at Stortford when we played them, I don't think they had nearly the attacking talent available that we did, but they were a well organised, well drilled unit who nullified us, and scrapped for every 50/50 and second ball. That's what I think we're lacking, and why we come unstuck against the better sides in the league who can stop us scoring freely.

I do think we might make the playoffs unless the wheels really start to come off from here - we've proven that we can beat the lower sides in the league, and our run in, on paper looks favourable to us, although I'd much rather be playing mid table sides than teams that are fighting for their survival in the league, and there will no doubt be some banana skins along the way that we do slip up on. As others have said, it's looking more and more like 4 from 5 to make the play offs, with Worthing being worthy winners... but there's a lot of football to play. Personally, I'd say 5th is a successful season, and I'd have taken that happily in August, and whilst over two one off games, you never know what can happen, our record against the better (and better organised) sides speaks for itself.

Does this mean that I don't think the management are the right people to take us forwards? I'm torn on this, I like Andy and team - they come across well whenever I've seen them interviewed and clearly care. They've shown they can assemble an excellent, and exciting squad and in spite of the shortcomings, I really enjoy watching this team. I think it's very unfair to suggest that we lack ambition as a club and don't want promotion, I think everyone at the club would agree that we want to get into the National South, but realistically that is the upper limit of our ambitions for the time being. Look at some of the cubs at that level, and the step above - they're huge sides with professional playing staff, and if we can get promoted, I'd be more than happy with consolidation/survival at that level. On the flip side, I think that we'd stand a better chance with a more organised, well drilled, maybe less individually talented team that retained possession better. I'm also very cautious as to what I wish for, as Andy and team have delivered one of the most successful seasons in our history, and any new management team coming in might well not make us more competitive.

I think overall we have to be pragmatic about what we can achieve as a club (I know I'll be accused of lacking ambition here by some), but relatively speaking we don't have a massive budget, aren't bankrolled by a money man, so we have to grow sustainably and organically. This clearly takes time, but in my view we're doing it the right way - gradually growing attendances, putting in place an academy scheme, embedding ourselves in the local community, looking at other income streams. Yes I'd love to be flying up the pyramid with a promotion every 5 or 10 years, but I don't think that's realistic - I'm immensely proud of the club and all it stands for, and even if we're at this level for the foreseeable future, I think it's a fantastic achievement for all involved.

To be fair ,part of the reason Andy was brought in was his 'contacts' in the game and his ability to put together a complete new squad at short notice.Unfortunately the first squad he assembled was not of good enough quality.Neither was the second regeneration of the squad, as was shown in the mid table and bottom half finishes.In fact the ability to put together a settled team,playing a settled formation and settled style of play seemed to elude us until this season.I thought we had finally turned a corner.

Also the assumption that the manager is fighting against the tide in terms of financing and size of club is not correct either.In the whole time Andy has been our manager the club has been 6th or 7th in the league for finances and for average gates,so a finish of 6th or 7th is par for the course.Anything better is an over achivement.Anything worse is an under achievement.After 3 years of under achieving i though we we going to actually over achieve this season.At the moment 'par for the course' is now looking most likely.

 

[Barney]

55 minutes ago, lovely stuff said:

To be fair ,part of the reason Andy was brought in was his 'contacts' in the game and his ability to put together a complete new squad at short notice.Unfortunately the first squad he assembled was not of good enough quality.Neither was the second regeneration of the squad, as was shown in the mid table and bottom half finishes.In fact the ability to put together a settled team,playing a settled formation and settled style of play seemed to elude us until this season.I thought we had finally turned a corner.

Also the assumption that the manager is fighting against the tide in terms of financing and size of club is not correct either.In the whole time Andy has been our manager the club has been 6th or 7th in the league for finances and for average gates,so a finish of 6th or 7th is par for the course.Anything better is an over achivement.Anything worse is an under achievement.After 3 years of under achieving i though we we going to actually over achieve this season.At the moment 'par for the course' is now looking most likely.

 

Don't disagree with either of your points LS, albeit I don't have any info on how large our budget is and how our finances stack up vs. other teams in the league. I think Andy should be cut some slack for the first season, as he was starting from effectively zero, and I would say that we've improved the squad season by season since then (although maybe results and league position haven't always followed).

To turn it around, if 6th is par for the course, would it be time to change the management if that's where we finished this year? Should we be looking to get in a new management team who might be able to overachieve, but also run the risk of starting from scratch again and maybe underachieving for a period of time? I'm not saying I know the answer, and I'm kinda glad I'm not the one who has to make the decision

[The Crowing Cockerel]

37 minutes ago, Barney said:

Don't disagree with either of your points LS, albeit I don't have any info on how large our budget is and how our finances stack up vs. other teams in the league. I think Andy should be cut some slack for the first season, as he was starting from effectively zero, and I would say that we've improved the squad season by season since then (although maybe results and league position haven't always followed).

To turn it around, if 6th is par for the course, would it be time to change the management if that's where we finished this year? Should we be looking to get in a new management team who might be able to overachieve, but also run the risk of starting from scratch again and maybe underachieving for a period of time? I'm not saying I know the answer, and I'm kinda glad I'm not the one who has to make the decision

Has Andy improved the squad season by season? Or has he got lucky with Mo's return and form for the first months of the season? Take Mo out of the team and I'd think we'd be lucky to be around 12th-15th in the league. Mo stops scoring and guess what? Yep, we stop winning! Worthing aren't reliant upon Oli Pearce for their goals. Hornchurch have had to do without Sam Higgins until very recently. Bishops Stortford dispensed with their top scorer in Jake Cass. All of them have still found a way to win recently. So is our squad actually that good?

My point really is that I don't see Andy being able to achieve any more next season (assuming we don't go up!). Mo will be moving on to pastures new - although possibly not the Football League. How is Andy going to replace those goals next season? I predict even more 'hoof ball' next season with AL. That is why I'd like to see a managerial change.